M6A2 with New Optics

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M6A2 with New Optics

Postby ezterra » Wed May 29, 2013 2:07 am

My Leupold Mark 6 1-6x just arrived today. Here are some shots of it on my M6A2 with an Aimpoint Micro T1 on an offset Larue LT724 mount. Hopefully I can get to the range this weekend to zero and test out the scope. Up for some shooting "theWOLFF"?

The illumination is daylight visible. I had the scope pointed at the white doors on my shed while the sun was shining on it, and I was able to see the illuminated reticle at 1x and at 6x. Although I don't have hardly any experience with optics, the glass seemed very clear and sharp. With the proper eye relief there is no black around the edges at 1x. All you see is the outline of the scope body. Edge to edge clarity also seems very good. I couldn't notice any distortion on the edges. The one interesting thing is that there isn't much forgiveness with the position of your eye. If you're slightly off center, the illumination moves off of the reticle then disappears. It's kind of a weird phenomena. All in all, I'm very pleased with the scope, but I've yet to shoot it.

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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby bastardsonofelvis » Wed May 29, 2013 7:07 pm

Does the optic have true 1X? What's with the micro then?
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby tact999 » Wed May 29, 2013 11:21 pm

I don't get that busy setup you got there.....could you explain it?


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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby ezterra » Thu May 30, 2013 1:33 am

This is an attempt to improve upon the shortcomings of what I had while I was in Afghanistan. I was running an Eotech 553 with a 3x magnifier. The deficiencies in this set up can be separated in to 3 areas; issues while making movement, issues while set in and pulling security, and three target identification (PID) and engagement.

1. Issues while making movement:

For anyone who's conducted dismounted operations knows that your gear will get filthy. It doesn't matter if it's a perfectly clear blue sky or if it's pissing rain. Your stuff is going to get dirty. The Eotech on it's own was great. I could always use it, it didn't matter if I sweat on it, got mud on it, or whatever, I could always use it. However, the magnifier was a different story. If I was moving through an area where the threat was a close engagement then I would just flip my magnifier to the side. This brings me to the second area.

My fix: Have covers over the main optic to keep things cleaner and more useable while still having the ability to access a RDS for close engagements.

2. Issues while set in and pulling security:

So now that we've climbed up and over countless grape rows, jumped way too many canals, didn't make the jump over the canal and fell in the water, climbed numerous mud walls, and probably dropped my M4 on an occasion or two, my magnifier is pretty much useless. It's so dirty and hazed over I have to pour water over it or spit on it to clean it best I can. 3x is already pretty feeble to aid in scanning my sector of fire when trying to PID beyond 250-300 meters. Add to this the haziness from not being able to get the magnifier cleaned, it makes PID even more difficult.

My fix: Keeping the main optic covered, in theory, should keep lenses much cleaner. At least dust and my own sweat won't be caking on to the lenses. Also a true telescopic scope versus just a magnifier is much better for target identification, especially having the capability to go 6x.

3. PID and engagement:

I already covered PID in 2 above. There were numerous time when I located a possible threat, but I was unable to engage because I could not get PID. I'm hoping the 6x will give me the ability to get PID more readily. I have been in engagements that ranged from 15 meters to beyond 500 meters. The 1-6x appears to give me the most versatility for the most engagement ranges. The redundant optical systems provides a back up should one system fail. I'll always have a RDS at the ready should I be caught off guard with either the scope covers down or the main optic set at 6x.

Basically what it came down to was that I want to run a low power variable scope. This would resolve the issues of PID as well as giving me the ability to make more reliable hits out to 500 meters and beyond. However, this does not address the issue of lenses becoming so dirty that there's always a constant haze in the sight picture. Also, I would still need some sort of a back up sight. I've thought about going with offset irons, but I'm willing to carry the extra few ounces to have a robust and durable RDS. Additionally, I feel I am much quicker on target at close range with an RDS.

Based on my experiences, here's how I plan to employ this system. While making movement, main optic has caps down and T1 on. I can easily engage from scary close out to 300 meters just as easily as with my Eotech. I have the capability of 6x to provide better PID as well as increasing my hit potential at distant targets. Finally, I have a dual sighting system which provides redundancy should one of the optics fail.

So what are the drawbacks that I expect. First weight. I don't run a PEQ-15 or PEQ-2A. So I'm guessing that the weight of my set up would not be much different than an Eotech, magnifier, and a PEQ-15 or PEQ-2A. Second issue would be bulk. The Aimpoint does sit offset, but it's actually much less cumbersome than a magnifier flipped to the side. I also chose the T1 over a Mini RDS because of the fact that it is sitting outboard and I have confidence the T1 can take the abuse. Although I don't have experience with Mini RDS, I really don't have confident in their toughness. Finally, it will take some training and trial and error to efficiently employ the dual optics as a complete system.

Well, I hope that all made sense. It's really not much different than someone wanting to run an offset RDS with any other magnified optic. Only I chose the T1 over a mini RDS because of its robustness. I'm willing to listen to ideas or other suggestions. It's not a set up I'm set in stone with, but I do want to give it an hones assessment. However, I am pretty set on using the Mark 6. In my experience the 3x magnifier just did not do what I hoped it would do. It was definitely better than no magnification, but I don't think it was worth its weight.
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby ezterra » Thu May 30, 2013 1:43 am

I forgot to add that I'm in the middle of a build right now that these optics will be going on. It will be a much lighter weight rifle than my LWRC. So the weight will be dropped dramatically once I get my rifle completed.

Also, it's not as busy at it seems. In my opinion it's not any busier than someone running a scope with offset irons. In fact, it seems to me that an offset RDS is less busy because all your doing is putting a red dot on the target and not lining up a front and rear sight.
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby mgrande » Thu May 30, 2013 9:45 am

Who are you with that let's you run your own gun???
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby ezterra » Thu May 30, 2013 11:28 am

mgrande wrote:Who are you with that let's you run your own gun???


I don't run my own gun. I have just a standard issued M4. We don't shoot nearly enough, especially now with the sequester. I run stuff on my personal ARs and use what I like on my M4. My unit doesn't care what we run on our weapons.
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby tact999 » Fri May 31, 2013 1:02 pm

Yes, I have done all of that stuff too in that giant landfill and still do not get it.

I get not using an Eotech, but I just think they are junk and never understand the whole magnifier and red dot setup anyway. Sorry Eotech lovers, no offense (I am forced to use one at work if its any consolation).

But you have a 1-6 and a red dot? So it is variable then ...right? Either way I guess it is just what people like, but I find an optic like an ACOG or a Browe which gives you the best of both worlds eliminates all that busyness.

Good luck in any case.
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby mgrande » Fri May 31, 2013 3:08 pm

I don't get it either. If anything you could just run a set of those offset/canted BUIS.
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby ezterra » Fri May 31, 2013 6:11 pm

mgrande wrote:I don't get it either. If anything you could just run a set of those offset/canted BUIS.


Not sure what you don't get. The redundancy of having multiple 1x optics? I don't really see a difference between having offset irons vs offset T1.

I really don't like the magnifier option either, but that's what I had and it was better than not having some sort of magnification.

At any rate, it's a setup I was introduced to by some guys we were supporting. I liked the idea and wanted to try it out. Worse case scenario, I don't like it and I can put the T1 on my wife's AR that we're trying to lighten up. However, I am pretty set on using the 1-6x. It's a really nice and versatile scope.
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby BigHat » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:28 am

If you like it that's all that matters. It's not like you're a couch commando or anything. Additionally, they clamp on the rail easily and come off the same way. :) Good luck!!!
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Re: M6A2 with New Optics

Postby fmxmyway » Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:49 pm

Thats a badass set-up. Kind of reminds me of this dudes at 2:47......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNNg5V8O ... wwcTxzIZhw
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